Engine Oil Seeping from Rear Main Seal

[Mitevo7]

Dear All,

Have a Volvo S60 T4 with DCT gearbox. 3 months ago, my mechanic feedback to me that there's engine oil seeping out from bell housing and engine oil cooler seal in a very slow manner. To confirmed our suspicious, We sealed the oil pan gasket, changed new engine oil cooler seal and new drain plug to test whether that's the final spot of leaking. For 3 months, there's no oil drip on the path way of my car poach, except for one week i didn't drive the car at all, there's a few drops on the ground.

Yesterday we lifted the car up to check for oil leaks and its still coming out from the bell housing which i didn't perform any repair on it. The undercarriage isn't very messy and i didn't need to add engine oil despite there's still leak. I am the 2nd owner of this car, the previous owner changed the rear main seal in about 120k on ODO at Federal Auto Glenmarie and that was about 3 years ago. Car is 6 years old though.

My question is, since its just seeping out from the bell housing, possibly a rear main seal problem again, do i need to worry about it or just wait until it developed into a leak. The costs of performing this rear can be up to 1.8k as i need to buy the seal which cost about 200 bucks, 800 bucks for dismantling, DCT and Engine Oil.

Thanks,
Ken

 

[gunnerzz]

Sounds like a very slow leak when stationary. Its not much of an issue, just need to wipe the floor every now and then.

Main concern is how much does it leak when u r driving it?

Me, i dont like dripping oil or fluid. I will replace the seal. Then again, the cost for yr car is...ouch.

If u want to fix it, buy the absolute best part or go back to ori. Alternative equivalent wont cut it. My mech learn this the hard way when replacing my WajaRenault oil seal...all for the sake of <RM50 price different for oil seal. The leak got worst after 2 days.

 

[Mitevo7]

Sounds like a very slow leak when stationary. Its not much of an issue, just need to wipe the floor every now and then.

Main concern is how much does it leak when u r driving it?

Me, i dont like dripping oil or fluid. I will replace the seal. Then again, the cost for yr car is...ouch.

If u want to fix it, buy the absolute best part or go back to ori. Alternative equivalent wont cut it. My mech learn this the hard way when replacing my WajaRenault oil seal...all for the sake of <RM50 price different for oil seal. The leak got worst after 2 days.

The seal is cheap but the labour is fucking crazy due to many parts need to be removed just to get to the seal. Like i described, engine oil level is still maintaining at optimum level after 3 months since the last inspection. I even took it to hard driving on Genting and outstations. Generally, the floor was clean if the car was driven every day or may be 3 days. I only see a few drops after 7 days of not driving it. Under carriage has only slightly messy look, not too oily kind. I am looking for someone that can do this cheaper, i guess the last job did by Federal Auto is shit, that's why the leaks came back.

Thanks,
Ken

 

[gunnerzz]

The seal is cheap but the labour is fucking crazy due to many parts need to be removed just to get to the seal. Like i described, engine oil level is still maintaining at optimum level after 3 months since the last inspection. I even took it to hard driving on Genting and outstations. Generally, the floor was clean if the car was driven every day or may be 3 days. I only see a few drops after 7 days of not driving it. Under carriage has only slightly messy look, not too oily kind. I am looking for someone that can do this cheaper, i guess the last job did by Federal Auto is shit, that's why the leaks came back.

Thanks,
Ken

Trust me, when u mentioned the price of your oil seal to those whom had only experienced japanese and local car in their lives...they will faint, wake up and then faint again.

BTW, changing the seal does not require engine oil and atf change right?
Just need to seperate the gearbox from the engine. Only that some GB like DSG require the GB to be at certain position or condition before it can be removed from the engine.

My guess is the job is done properly, maybe the seal is shit.

 

[Mitevo7]

Trust me, when u mentioned the price of your oil seal to those whom had only experienced japanese and local car in their lives...they will faint, wake up and then faint again.

BTW, changing the seal does not require engine oil and atf change right?
Just need to seperate the gearbox from the engine. Only that some GB like DSG require the GB to be at certain position or condition before it can be removed from the engine.

My guess is the job is done properly, maybe the seal is shit.

The seal came with a adapter plate or something like that. Changing the seal requires no oil change but i think some oil or DSG fluid will spill out. Its the labour that is expensive ... MYR 800 for dropping all the components and reassembly them. That's why rear main seal is one of the most labour intensive job. He asked me to budget in 2k as he worried when dropping down other things we might see something else went bonkers, just in case.

 

[Izso]

Paging @Nightstalker1993 your volvo expertise is needed

 

[Mitevo7]

Paging @Nightstalker1993 your volvo expertise is needed

Thanks for the help mate ! Needed 2nd opinion before committed to such a high cost repair for simple issue.

 

[Mitevo7]

Apparently we are looking at the wrong place, i just discovered the actual route of the oil leak seems travel from the middle of the block and ended the bell housing. If i am not wrong, right underneath the intake manifold, there's a turbo oil return housing, as i zoomed into the place and look with flashlight, i can see the place is fucking filthy and can see traces of oil travel towards bell housing. Today will jack up the car and look again and underneath. Too many components blocking the view so that might cause us to mistaken rear main seal is leaking.

To add on, the leak we spotted at bell housing isn't wet and shinny, it was dry and muddy, unlike the oil stain that i spotted on the oil sump, it wet and shinny.

 

[gunnerzz]

Apparently we are looking at the wrong place, i just discovered the actual route of the oil leak seems travel from the middle of the block and ended the bell housing. If i am not wrong, right underneath the intake manifold, there's a turbo oil return housing, as i zoomed into the place and look with flashlight, i can see the place is fucking filthy and can see traces of oil travel towards bell housing. Today will jack up the car and look again and underneath. Too many components blocking the view so that might cause us to mistaken rear main seal is leaking.

To add on, the leak we spotted at bell housing isn't wet and shinny, it was dry and muddy, unlike the oil stain that i spotted on the oil sump, it wet and shinny.

Buy an endoscope...well below RM100 and works with any android supporting USB OTG. A very handy tools.

Filthy means its been there a while and a bit hard to determine the leak volume as the oil is absorbed by the dirt first before it start to drip at the bottom.

 

[Mitevo7]

Buy an endoscope...well below RM100 and works with any android supporting USB OTG. A very handy tools.

Filthy means its been there a while and a bit hard to determine the leak volume as the oil is absorbed by the dirt first before it start to drip at the bottom.

Yeah i will invest that in future, the intake manifold is totally blocked that place in every angle, that's why we couldn't see it from anywhere until i zoomed into it by using a phone.

 

[Mitevo7]

Just got back from the mechanic and this is what i found, apparently the leak came from the middle of the block, from some sort of black box thingy, under the intake manifold. Here is the picture of it. This engine is similar to Ford Fiesta ST engine, very punchy but requires a bit of care. Forummers please tell me what you think.

Thanks,
Ken

 

[gunnerzz]

Just got back from the mechanic and this is what i found, apparently the leak came from the middle of the block, from some sort of black box thingy, under the intake manifold. Here is the picture of it. This engine is similar to Ford Fiesta ST engine, very punchy but requires a bit of care. Forummers please tell me what you think.

Thanks,
Ken

I believe u r referring to the oil cooler. Possible to check if its leaking from the hose or the gasket where it meets with the engine?
Either way, i strongly believe its a cheap fix.

 

[parakey]

I think this image of the engine may be more helpful. Kindly point out where the leak is

 

[vr2turbo]

Cannot find actual start point then need to clean up and check from there.....

 

[Mitevo7]

View attachment 576147

I think this image of the engine may be more helpful. Kindly point out where the leak is

Very nice image ! Here is the photo, the arrow on the left is where I spotted the leaks are most severe. The arrow on the right is where the leak travelled down and making their way to bell housing and oil pan. I kinda determine that RMS isn’t faulty as there isn’t fresh drip there, but dry.

The fresh ones are on oil pan and also right on those area with left arrow.

 

[Mitevo7]

Cannot find actual start point then need to clean up and check from there.....

The leak came from above oil cooler. I do not know what is that black box. Is it a crank case breather ?

 

[parakey]

The leak came from above oil cooler. I do not know what is that black box. Is it a crank case breather ?

Do you mean this? It's the heater control valve

 

[parakey]

This picture may be helpful

 

[Mitevo7]

View attachment 576161
This picture may be helpful

Here is the more precise one, i spotted the place is most filthy, and the leaked oil travelled down to oil cooler and oil sump below.

 

[parakey]

I think that might be the oil trap/separator. You might want to check the hose leading into it first. Looks difficult to access

 

[Izso]

@parakey your googling image skills are impeccable!

 

[Izso]

So based on Mitevo's feedback it might just be this black thing which Parakey has identified as the oil separator. Anything this plasticky sure will have a o-ring which will probably fail.

 

[gunnerzz]

View attachment 576164

So based on Mitevo's feedback it might just be this black thing which Parakey has identified as the oil separator. Anything this plasticky sure will have a o-ring which will probably fail.

Looks like have to work by feel if dont want to remove the intake manifold.

 

[Mitevo7]

View attachment 576164

So based on Mitevo's feedback it might just be this black thing which Parakey has identified as the oil separator. Anything this plasticky sure will have a o-ring which will probably fail.

Yes this is the one we saw its probably leaking oil, even the pipe is filthy. Lets hope for the best, anyhow still need to take off the intake manifold to gain access.

 

[Mitevo7]

@parakey your googling image skills are impeccable!

I know right ! He is a life saver !

 

[Mitevo7]

Looks like have to work by feel if dont want to remove the intake manifold.

Its too tight, if don’t want to lose engine oil i think its best to remove the intake manifold rather than engine oil cooler to gain access.

 

[parakey]

Looks like have to work by feel if dont want to remove the intake manifold.

Will be very difficult to access. Starter & TB seems to be in the way too. Do let us know how it went

 

[parakey]

Will be very difficult to access. Starter & TB seems to be in the way too. Do let us know how it went

Or if it's just a minor leak, why not leave it as it is for the moment?

 

[Mitevo7]

Or if it's just a minor leak, why not leave it as it is for the moment?

Hi, if could i would like my car bone dry with no leaking at all. Furthermore if its an easy fix better take care of it before the oil clogged up the other area where it shouldn't be. Furthermore, we can't be 100% sure its the oil separator part that is causing the leakage, since i am determined to dismantle it to check for it, might as well as 100% sure of the issue and get rid of it.

 

[sweelt]

@parakey your googling image skills are impeccable!

he own super computer at home...

 

[Mitevo7]

Dear All,

Finally managed to track down the oil leak locations. Just as parakey and Izso pinpointed, the leak starts from the oil trap/separator. The gasket on this thing has shrink by bit and oil seal on the hose also degarded.

Does anyone know whether the oil separator is a replacement item or i can reuse it with adding gasket gum ?

 

[Izso]

Dear All,

Finally managed to track down the oil leak locations. Just as parakey and Izso pinpointed, the leak starts from the oil trap/separator. The gasket on this thing has shrink by bit and oil seal on the hose also degarded.

Does anyone know whether the oil separator is a replacement item or i can reuse it with adding gasket gum ?

If it's plastic it'll be probably be a replacement item. Might have deformed over the years

 

[gunnerzz]

Dear All,

Finally managed to track down the oil leak locations. Just as parakey and Izso pinpointed, the leak starts from the oil trap/separator. The gasket on this thing has shrink by bit and oil seal on the hose also degarded.

Does anyone know whether the oil separator is a replacement item or i can reuse it with adding gasket gum ?

Pls dont use back by adding gasket maker. The part is hard to reach and not worth the try.

Better option is to replace the rubber gasket. A tad more expensive is to replace the plastic part.

 

[Mitevo7]

If it's plastic it'll be probably be a replacement item. Might have deformed over the years

What's actually inside the box ? Some says its actually empty inside, just for blow by gases to goes through and goes back into engine.

Pls dont use back by adding gasket maker. The part is hard to reach and not worth the try.

Better option is to replace the rubber gasket. A tad more expensive is to replace the plastic part.

Understanding Volvo's spare parts nature, they won't make any gasket for this thing, it will be the whole thing. If the price isn't ridiculously priced then i will replace the whole thing.

 

[Izso]

What's actually inside the box ? Some says its actually empty inside, just for blow by gases to goes through and goes back into engine.

Hidden gold. Great place to hide your stash of drugs... hehehehe.

I think it's just a place for the oil to "cool down" and condense then get sucked back in to the engine. Some sort of environmental thing. I honestly have no idea. Don't own a Volvo, never have either.

 

[Mitevo7]

Hidden gold. Great place to hide your stash of drugs... hehehehe.

I think it's just a place for the oil to "cool down" and condense then get sucked back in to the engine. Some sort of environmental thing. I honestly have no idea. Don't own a Volvo, never have either.

As far as we look inside this piece of non-environmental box, its nothing inside but some sort of wire mash. When we pour some oil in, it just went right through to the other side. It simply to trap any blow by gases that might carry oil along with it. The diagnose return that the box is fully functional with only lower part of the gasket expired. My repair is too use gasket gum to glue it dead and reroute the oil passage to a catch can. Don't need this damn thing at all and don't need to spend 650 bucks for this thing

 

[gunnerzz]

As far as we look inside this piece of non-environmental box, its nothing inside but some sort of wire mash. When we pour some oil in, it just went right through to the other side. It simply to trap any blow by gases that might carry oil along with it. The diagnose return that the box is fully functional with only lower part of the gasket expired. My repair is too use gasket gum to glue it dead and reroute the oil passage to a catch can. Don't need this damn thing at all and don't need to spend 650 bucks for this thing

650 is steep for the repair.
From the way u describe it, its like an oil catch can except the oil is not collected in a can but recycled back to the engine.

 

[Mitevo7]

650 is steep for the repair.
From the way u describe it, its like an oil catch can except the oil is not collected in a can but recycled back to the engine.

Yes its a stock crappy catch can that installed on to the engine block. Inside has nothing else rather than wire mesh. I will report back when the repair is done.

 

[vr2turbo]

650 is steep for the repair.
From the way u describe it, its like an oil catch can except the oil is not collected in a can but recycled back to the engine.

Had a few friends who own Volvo before, most sold them off saying high maintenance. Only those with the old 244 keep them until cannot repair.....lol

 

[parakey]

need to spend 650 bucks for this thing

https://volvozone.eu/product/volvo-...v40-ii-v40-xc-p3-s60-ii-v60-ii-s80-ii-v70-iii

Dang, Volvo parts are so expensive. These oil traps are supposed to last only 100k km. It makes e46 parts dirt cheap.

If it's only the rubber seal that's causing the minor leak, I guess you can try o ring cords.

 

[Mitevo7]

https://volvozone.eu/product/volvo-...v40-ii-v40-xc-p3-s60-ii-v60-ii-s80-ii-v70-iii

Dang, Volvo parts are so expensive. These oil traps are supposed to last only 100k km. It makes e46 parts dirt cheap.

If it's only the rubber seal that's causing the minor leak, I guess you can try o ring cords.

Yeah from factory it says last about 100k km, however that is provided if you didn’t change oil often and sludge built up the system. What we found out on those hoses, no block at all or any sludge in the system, that could due to in my ownership, i flushed the crap out of this engine. I used GDI cleaner to clean the intake valves in every single oil change.

Our family had a V40 2.0 Turbo before, the car’s maintenance isn’t very costly. To be frank, some of the spare parts are just as expensive as my lancer. Lancer’s engine and gearbox mounting job costed me MYR1950 inclusive of labour. This Volvo from service record, it shows the parts only cost MYR1600. So i would say its kinda close.

 

[parakey]

I just had a thought. Have you tried looking for this replacement spare part as a Ford product as opposed to Volvo?

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Genuine-Quality-Oil-Separator-BM5G-6A785_60774899603.html


https://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-FIEST...084410?hash=item21434dab7a:g:gZoAAOSwj3xbRf1G

 

[Mitevo7]

I just had a thought. Have you tried looking for this replacement spare part as a Ford product as opposed to Volvo?

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Genuine-Quality-Oil-Separator-BM5G-6A785_60774899603.html


https://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-FIEST...084410?hash=item21434dab7a:g:gZoAAOSwj3xbRf1G

Oh yeah i haven’t thought of that, the looks of the part you shared looks identical. I may wanna check. Thanks for the tip !

 

[vr2turbo]

I just had a thought. Have you tried looking for this replacement spare part as a Ford product as opposed to Volvo?

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Genuine-Quality-Oil-Separator-BM5G-6A785_60774899603.html


https://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-FIEST...084410?hash=item21434dab7a:g:gZoAAOSwj3xbRf1G

Does Volvo use Ford parts? I know my Chery GB is Renault......lol

 

[Izso]

All hail our google king! How on earth did you manage to find out the parts are the same? @parakey

 

[parakey]

V

Does Volvo use Ford parts? I know my Chery GB is Renault......lol

Volvo was previously owned by Ford right? If not mistaken, that powertrain was lifted off Ford's Ecoboost

 

[Mitevo7]

Does Volvo use Ford parts? I know my Chery GB is Renault......lol

My Volvo S60 II uses similar engine to Ford Kuga 1.6T Ecoboost and Ford Fiesta ST Ecoboost plus with Ford Powershift Wet Clutch GB. As far as i traced, most components are shared, just that buying from Volvo vs buying from Ford, the prices are damn big difference.

 

[Mitevo7]

V

Volvo was previously owned by Ford right? If not mistaken, that powertrain was lifted off Ford's Ecoboost

Exactly, Ford owned Volvo for a while until Geely took over. In terms of powertrain, its shared from Ford Ecoboost family from 1.6T to 2.0T. Only some Swedish model, 2.5T uses 5 cylinders from Volvo.

 

[parakey]

http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/understanding-your-pcv-system-upgrades-and-catch-cans/

This is a good read.

 

[Mitevo7]

http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/understanding-your-pcv-system-upgrades-and-catch-cans/

This is a good read.

Yeah it is a good read. I am going to modify the catch cans into it.