4G91 Gang..

[Sky222]

using GSR air flow straight than can detect boost edi???
i really not very sure on this....
sigh.....

bro alvin.....
wat i'm saying is.....
with the same amount of money...say 10k....
can do up 4g91 meaning all the internal parts change.....
OR....
convert to a stock 4g63t.....
no doubt the money n time spent on 4g91 BOT might not giv u more power than 4g63....
BUT.....u get to enjoy the process.....
anyway...
just a casual remarks la.....
dun take it so seriously.....

abt the JUN cams....
i can see fire comin up edi wei!!!!
but well....japanese do speak english la.....
anyway....dun need to war over here la....
most of us poor modders....
how to afford such cams???
wahahahahaha

bro joe...
its really tempting....
but now in the process of paying off debt.....
wahahahaha

Hahah dun care lar..ppl dun believe is their problem lar ... ... what to do ....the Jun Cam come with Manual and valve spring ...

but im wondering RPW got cams for 4G9x or not ...im wondering ....

and 449 Air Flow can detect geh..but the problem is Enof to detect the flow or not ....if going to hight boost ....like up to 1.7 bar

coz evo 7 original air flow sensor ...if i boost at 1.7 bar...its limited d ....

coz air flow giving signal to ECU to send petrol signal to injector

Thats why aftermarket got 3 Bar Map sensor up to 5 Bar ( from Haltech , Motec ) Haltech and Motec Map Sensors is the same

im using 3 Bar Map Sensor on my Haltech E6x :) more than enof...even the original E6x build in with Map Sensor...

Original E6x build in map sensor atmospheral 2.5 bar ..can detect boost up to 1.5 Bar

bro ..when free come out have a drink lar ...kekeke let u test my car ....

Now boosting at 1.6 bar without knocking problem ....

Engine also with ARP Studs ...

 

[chongkeat_87]

well my friend its running a workshop....

u see...

1 bullet original from MMC with cost u RM 55 and there is 16 bullet....

its cost few hundred bucks d...then ...u wanna overhaul ur engine..because its eat engine oil

there also will cost u arond RM 1k .....

after fix it arr..i think will reach 2 K d ~

hey sorry 4 late reply..
wow, 2k ar..
er if duwan mmc leh:hmmmm:
how much is it for 1
n for u, u reco me to change engine or overhaul:hmmmm:

 

[MiTec-i]

sky...where u build ur car?glenmarie?

 

[chongkeat_87]

the bullet (hydraulic lifter/lash adjuster) can be service if it not wear (makan/haus), usually the noise is result from dirty engine oil that stuck in the tiny oil passage in it. just take out all the lifter, press slowly using vice to let all the dirty oil out.
To take out the lifter is not necessary to take out the cam (some mechanic doesn't know this)

For the engine oil, try Magnatec, this oil I find very friendly to the lifter

As for carb, I would like to suggest Weber DGAV series, as it is progressive carb, give you power as well not 'makan' you on fuel. If it tune nicely will more economical than injection, provided you not floor you pedal hehehehe

For the overhaul you can get around 1K, changing valve seal, pistong ring, head gasket set.

While you were there, add litle bit more to rebore and plonk in high comp piston

hope this will help and happy modding

hey, thx bro 4 so many info..

i see until blur d haha..

u reali keng in modding man..

i heard b4 bout da hydraulic lifter take out without taking out da cam. but i dunno how to do it..

bout da gasket, wats da diff if i change it to metal gasket

n ur english too deep for me, haha, wats plonk.. wats da actual size n how much i hv to rebore:hmmmm: if i rebore..

 

[Sky222]

sky...where u build ur car?glenmarie?

Build by

AZ MOTORSPORTS OUG :)

and myself ...

at first i dun expect its successful since 1.6 pushing TD05 20G..sure lag..but ..came out...satisfied :) happy driving

 

[ayell]

hey, thx bro 4 so many info..

i see until blur d haha..

u reali keng in modding man..

i heard b4 bout da hydraulic lifter take out without taking out da cam. but i dunno how to do it..

bout da gasket, wats da diff if i change it to metal gasket

n ur english too deep for me, haha, wats plonk.. wats da actual size n how much i hv to rebore:hmmmm: if i rebore..

hahahah i thot my english is very 'berterabur' one

metal gasket is more tahan than normal gasket, and more thinner (of coz it also have thicker), i use 0.8mm (if not mistaken), more thinner u get higher compression.

the safe size to rebore is 81mm, equals to 4G92 & 93 size. Used high comp piston from normal 4G92 (cheaper and easy to get) or 4G92 MIVEC (better)

to take out the lifter just use big screw driver to remove the rocker by jacking it then pull out the lifter using magnet. U might need to turn the cam, to free the rocker.

 

[chongkeat_87]

91 carb is electro carburetor, have a tiny so called computer box. Hard to find a mechanic that able to tune it, so normally they just disable it.

ur car using this carb??
is it good enough??
rm350?? new or second hand??
i heard from my fren, a new wan coz ard rm500 is it??

u r so good in this man..reali need to call u sifu.. hahaha

 

[chongkeat_87]

hahahah i thot my english is very 'berterabur' one

metal gasket is more tahan than normal gasket, and more thinner (of coz it also have thicker), i use 0.8mm (if not mistaken), more thinner u get higher compression.

the safe size to rebore is 81mm, equals to 4G92 & 93 size. Used high comp piston from normal 4G92 (cheaper and easy to get) or 4G92 MIVEC (better)

to take out the lifter just use big screw driver to remove the rocker by jacking it then pull out the lifter using magnet. U might need to turn the cam, to free the rocker.

wats da actual size of 4G91 bore??
how much da 4G92 high comp piston cost normally??
i reali reali need to learn more bout it edi... hahahaha
hey bro, reali reali thx alot for ur info
ur english reali very keng as well as in car..

 

[ayell]

ur car using this carb??
is it good enough??
rm350?? new or second hand??
i heard from my fren, a new wan coz ard rm500 is it??

u r so good in this man..reali need to call u sifu.. hahaha

nope.. I'm using pair of Weber DCOE40 now, please see at my avatar, I use ori 91 carb only few month after install engine, after that I use SM4 Carb (Honda Accord, need to make tapak to fit in), you might want to try Pajero carb, good too, direct fit, but please find the local version, if Japs import ver so many vacuum hose that can't be use.

for the price i think 4g91 carb is cheaper than that as not many ppl wants it. That was few years back, I dunno now.

 

[ayell]

wats da actual size of 4G91 bore??
how much da 4G92 high comp piston cost normally??
i reali reali need to learn more bout it edi... hahahaha
hey bro, reali reali thx alot for ur info
ur english reali very keng as well as in car..

original 91 bore is 78.4mm, stroke 77.5mm

4G92 standard piston is high comp piston, so the price is not that hight, last time I bought 4 unit is about rm2xx if not mistaken (3 years back)

heheheh i'm not keng lorr.. just have a bit experience (sweet & bitter) playing this engine since 2002, and I love this engine so much!

 

[Sky222]

original 91 bore is 78.4mm, stroke 77.5mm

4G92 standard piston is high comp piston, so the price is not that hight, last time I bought 4 unit is about rm2xx if not mistaken (3 years back)

heheheh i'm not keng lorr.. just have a bit experience (sweet & bitter) playing this engine since 2002, and I love this engine so much!

but if with 4G92 Piston. the knocking will be higher compare with stock piston means that need to use aftermarker , Piggy back or stand alone ECU to control the ignition timing

and then Original 4G91 piston size is 78.4mm but once we put 4G92 stock piston size is 81mm
It might cause danger to the block , Each modification on piston oversize must not more than 2mm

Pro's : It giving a car better power and a little cc upgrade ,

Con's : Might cause Block piston wall to broke ,
It might causing the engine temparature higher because the piston wall and block water
line already thinner .....
there is limitation for future overhaul because already too oversize ....

Just my 2 cents :hmmmm:

 

[ayell]

yes there is a cons to that, like if machine shop not doing it properly, higher engine temp, etc. But as far as I know (I've measured this myself), the liner for 91 & 92 is the same just that 91's is not bored as big as 92's, so my 2 cents it is safe to bore to the size of 92. To be more safer, changing the liner to 92's is the way. For the temp, using the 92's size of radiator helps.

 

[Sky222]

yes there is a cons to that, like if machine shop not doing it properly, higher engine temp, etc. But as far as I know (I've measured this myself), the liner for 91 & 92 is the same just that 91's is not bored as big as 92's, so my 2 cents it is safe to bore to the size of 92. To be more safer, changing the liner to 92's is the way. For the temp, using the 92's size of radiator helps.

izzit? but still if changing the radiators ..also the engine temp also still hot and the radiator will help...

anyway this kind of setting ...might cause engine damage if keep revving like some ppl drive like crazy ......

as far as my concern ...on Mitsubishi repair manual book stated the linear and the block thickness is different ..... i measure like u also last time and though that its not bore to size of 92.....but Mitsubishi guidelines ...stated the other way ..... :hmmmm: well need to get more knowledge of this

 

[ayell]

maybe ure rite on this, the manufacturer guidelines is more accurate.

Whats I wrote at above is only base on my experience, not official ya.

As in my case the mod I've done so far not harming my engine (at lease not yet , touch wood it won't heheheh) and I rev my engine kaw2 (everyday),also do some friendly drag.

Disclaimer to all: Mod at your own risk

 

[Sky222]

maybe ure rite on this, the manufacturer guidelines is more accurate.

Whats I wrote at above is only base on my experience, not official ya.

As in my case the mod I've done so far not harming my engine (at lease not yet , touch wood it won't heheheh) and I rev my engine kaw2 (everyday),also do some friendly drag.

Disclaimer to all: Mod at your own risk

heheh .....thx Ayell..~ we can share experience ....

MOD AT YOUR OWN RISK ... kekekeke ....I also mod my car at very high risk ler ...

 

[MiTec-i]

yea....i hav been using 82mm piston for years...i expect the block to crack within months...but nuthin happened...most probably the machine shop did a fantastic job and the overhaulin job i did myself was luckily good enuf....but i somehow dun recommend bore to 82mm...81mm is just fine i think...the temperature did increase,so i opt for aluminum radiator and racing thermostat....tat helps...owh...and oso bigger and an extra fan to cope....

ayell is a carburetor sifoo!!tat i support and darely voice out....chongkeat....save money and buy the webber...u wil not regret....the power and especially the sound it make....orgasmic i tell you....but tat was on my 1.3carb....on ayell 's 'modster' 91.....should be hell alot better!

 

[ayell]

In term of sound of weber, you will get every sound in it.. MIVEC, VTEC sound, you name it hahaha, turbine spooling sound as well (when carb tapak gasket have tiny leakage hehehehe), if your exhaust not loud enuf, you will hear only the roaring at front

 

[chongkeat_87]

yea....i hav been using 82mm piston for years...i expect the block to crack within months...but nuthin happened...most probably the machine shop did a fantastic job and the overhaulin job i did myself was luckily good enuf....but i somehow dun recommend bore to 82mm...81mm is just fine i think...the temperature did increase,so i opt for aluminum radiator and racing thermostat....tat helps...owh...and oso bigger and an extra fan to cope....

ayell is a carburetor sifoo!!tat i support and darely voice out....chongkeat....save money and buy the webber...u wil not regret....the power and especially the sound it make....orgasmic i tell you....but tat was on my 1.3carb....on ayell 's 'modster' 91.....should be hell alot better!

haha.. sure sure..
he is reali carburetor sifuu..
er MiTec, whr did u rebore ur block:hmmmm:
as i known i know da few reali sucks in reboring
most of my fren do edi, not overheat den crack block
n their hand work reali not licin at all..

 

[alvin24]

Tappets:
There is a special tool u can use to remove the tappets without removing cams actually. =p Some workshops have it... last time I changed mine also they used it. =p Did mine at SkyZone at Sunway Mas there.


Jun Cams:
As for the JUN cams, I'm merely stating my worries mah, since they never announced the availability for high cams for 4G93, its very highly doubt-able that they actually produced them. Again, its not meant to flame people selling it claiming its fake, but to bring up awareness to public when purchasing doubtful products... although that sooner is also an indirect effect, i meant for the latter, really.

I didn't know Mutiara workers are required to speak Japanese, neither can I think for a reason for them to. =p I worked in Toyota before also, but still haven't learnt enuff to strike a proper full conversation. =p Then i quit... too life-less to work there as a production engineer. =p

Anyhowz, we can't come up with a solution arguing like this. I tell u what... I'll email them, and post their reply here. =) I'm also curious to know if its really them manufacturing cams for 93s or not... again, not implying that its DEFINITELY fake. Just saying that its very doubtful.

p/s: I'm not saying GT auto and all are selling all fake products (claiming they're ori). I'm saying if u wanna order fake products from them, they can still get it for u. =p


Rebore issue:
Technically it would make more sense production wise to build the 4G92 and 4G91 block exactly the same only with different bores (water jacket positioning the same, etc)... because redesigning a block would involve a very very hefty price, including having different manufacturing lines for them rather than doing it in the same line.

But at the same time, many foreman has told me before they run very slightly. Thats the reason for people 4G92p plonk in 4g91 DOHC use paper gasket will leak after a while, and/or other weird issues arrises that suggests this.

I haven't personally measured, so I can't say for sure which is right/wrong... den again, if the offset has a difference also, its not gonna be easy to use a ruler and be able to tell that it run by 1mm. =p That method's accuracy is poor.

So this unfortunately still remains a very debatable topic till today. Many have done rebore and succeeded, while others that have failed would be totally against this. My take? Better safe than sorry... so I never rebored, and never suggested. For me I wasn't that willing to spend big on the 4g91, i do what I can... but when it comes to super extreme mods, I'd rather get a stronger platform to begin with. Thats just me, I know there are die-hard 4g91 fans out there who spend shitloads on theirs and the satisfaction gained is worth every penny to them. =)

My 4g91 kicked 170whp as my top record as a 4G91 running on stock internals at 0.8bar boost. Can whack stock GSRs, and be on par with some GSRs running 1 bar... okie la... happy enuff for me. For all I know those GSRs i play wif all potato thats why can win.. maybe I fight with healthy wan i lose leh? haha... too many variables to conclude that i can tapau all GSRs. =p Anything and everything can happen in a race mar. =)

Loads of $$$ invested, but the knowledge and experience gained is priceless. =) I'm sure many of u modders out there feel the same way! Unless u did a project spend 2k and end up car no difference... then maybe you'll be swearing away laaaa. hahaha... happened to me before also lar... I changed exhaust setup like 4-5 times on my 4G91 leh! haha... cannot find ngam wan end up spend summore. =p

About the bore 2mm issue pulak... I think its quite dependant on the engine itself lah. Some engines can rebore more safely. =p


shiet... damn chut long reply! Till here first!

 

[chongkeat_87]

nope.. I'm using pair of Weber DCOE40 now, please see at my avatar, I use ori 91 carb only few month after install engine, after that I use SM4 Carb (Honda Accord, need to make tapak to fit in), you might want to try Pajero carb, good too, direct fit, but please find the local version, if Japs import ver so many vacuum hose that can't be use.

for the price i think 4g91 carb is cheaper than that as not many ppl wants it. That was few years back, I dunno now.

of almost all da carb u hv been used, which wan gv u da best performance??
i hv some fren ask me to try 1.6 carb but u hv to mod d tapak??
do u know any place or any website then i can look for carb, used or new also no probe..
last time my car still got pick up but now wat also dun hv..no top speed no power but i still main with 1 gti n putra this morning at highway.. haha.. morning drive gv me da best drive, in d noon, press d accelerator like hell also wont move..
n just now on da way back, when i change to 3rd gear my car vibrate more than normal.. edi replace da mounting less than a year ago, y does this happen:hmmmm:
Ayell Sifu HELP!!!