Anyone tried Ron 100 on Airtrek Turbo?

[stutzedward]

Been a hoohaa about this Ron 100 fuel. Anyone tried it? I supposed it will be very beneficial for forced induction engines... I have not tried it yet.

I am currently using Shell 95. Comparable to 97 or 98, it's a lot weaker especially throttle response and turbo lag. During hot afternoons, the car is heavy and not very willing. Shell is one of the worse fuel I used before. Even Caltex or Petronas 95 runs stronger in my car. However I still use it for a reason. It really gave me more mileage.

When I use Petronas and Caltex 95, my tank goes dry as early as 260km per full tank. On Shell 95, sometimes I reach the 300 mark but usually 280km. This is pure city driving with 'moderate jam'. I don't really need high boost or power since I'll be stucked in jam anyway, so that's why I continued using Shell for the reason of better mileage.

I once spoke to GT Auto boss, he said Shell fuel is really bad for performance because that have added too much addictive to prevent it from evaporating in the fuel tank during hot days, hence it hampered the performance. So all these make sense to me.....

So if you want to dyno your car, do not refuel with Shell 95. Go with 100 now (if you are seeking for peak power) or Caltex/Petronas 95 if you want to do a remap.

Just sharing my views... :wavey:

 

[vr2turbo]

If dyno with Ron 100, and tune proper then use Ron 95 or 97 sure not good dy.....hhahahahha

I have been Mobil then Petron user for a long time, but also due to station near my house. Got 1 time my friend use Shell also say give better mileage so I tried them for first time and Ron97 not 95. This was during their Fuel Save Ron 97. After filling up start to go, and after a while when fuel line with Petron used up the Shell fuel starting going in and that was when the car start to struggle, knock and could not idle proper even. After driving home I had to siphon all the fuel out and transfer them to my Hyundai that requires Ron 91 only, so in that car no problem. But the thing is Petron Ron 95 my VR can run, why not Shell even with Ron 97? The best thing was after a month or two Shell changed their Fuel save Ron 97 to V power 97.....something must be wrong with that fuel......hhahahhahahhaha

 

[stutzedward]

Yes, Shell fuel doesn't do well in performance like I shared.

I understand that the ECU in Evo/Airtrek (not sure about VR4) is able to determine the Ron level, hence engaging different map setting. When my tuner tuned my car, he ran on standard fuel and then added octane and retune the map for higher Ron. He said if I ever refuel higher Ron, the setting will change to produce more power...

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

ecu use knock sensor to detect knock and adjust ignition timing...

so if ecu was reset and tune using highest ron available....then next time running with lower ron, the ecu will retard ignition when it detect knock... (knock correction table) so thats how the ecu adjust itself

 

[vr2turbo]

Yes, Shell fuel doesn't do well in performance like I shared.

I understand that the ECU in Evo/Airtrek (not sure about VR4) is able to determine the Ron level, hence engaging different map setting. When my tuner tuned my car, he ran on standard fuel and then added octane and retune the map for higher Ron. He said if I ever refuel higher Ron, the setting will change to produce more power...

Nope, mine should be old school, because mechanic manually adjust the timing....

 

[4gbanger]

i guess if running with ron 100 with no proper tune up, then it would be a waste.. or maybe reflash it to ron 95 and ron 100 mapping for peak performance.. two different mapping and two different power.. aite??

 

[stutzedward]

yup...

 

[Ss_Tuner]

Correct,mitsubishi has one of the sensitive knock sensors around.

Airtrek has 2 MAPS for ignition timing
1)High Octane = BASE TIMING MAP (No Knock Detected)
2)Low Ocatene = MIN TIMING MAP (High Knock Detected)

Due to the nature of Airtrek High knocking engine, tuner always reduce the ignition timing at peak boost and high rpm to acceptable timing (see RON95 MAP) to compensate knock

Even if you put in RON100, the maximum timing run with this map will still be limited by RON95 MAP,the only way u would see benefit is to reflash RON97/RON100 Map to the Airtrek. (this only applicable to tuned airtrek as stock standard ATR ecu from JAPAN are normally set for 'HI-OKU' = RON100 ( but with when run with RON95 super duper knock, hahaha)

In summary No - ATR will not adapt to RON100 ignition timing, just significantly less knock and smoother power delivery.


In Contrary : MAZDA recent (Post2013) ECU algorithm have 3 BASE MAP

1)BASE TIMING MAP (No Knock Detected)
2)MAX TIMING MAP (No Further Knock Detected)
2)MIN TIMING MAP (High Knock Detected)

Mazda ecu will use BASE TIMING MAP and listen to knock, if no furthrer knock detected.
The ECU will add ignition timing more (until it hit MAX TIMING MAP) , so if u use RON100, and BASE TIMING is at 11 degree. If there is no further knock detected. The ignition Timing will be added incrementally(up to +5 = 16 degree <-examples only) automatically by ecu.
MIN TIMING MAP similar to mitsu's when it detected high knock and Timing will be reduced.



(BELOW IMAGE AS EXAMPLES ONLY-DON'T TAKE IT SERIOUSLY.)

ecu use knock sensor to detect knock and adjust ignition timing...

so if ecu was reset and tune using highest ron available....then next time running with lower ron, the ecu will retard ignition when it detect knock... (knock correction table) so thats how the ecu adjust itself

 

[Shinjite]

Is your daily routine to work 100% jam?
260-280km full tank is terrible mileage

 

[stutzedward]

I travel daily in moderate jams. Which mean early morning driving & after work driving. Sometimes the jam could be bad.

---------- Post added at 04:00 PM ---------- 6 hour anti-bump limit - Previous post was at 03:58 PM ----------

Correct,mitsubishi has one of the sensitive knock sensors around.

Airtrek has 2 MAPS for ignition timing
1)High Octane = BASE TIMING MAP (No Knock Detected)
2)Low Ocatene = MIN TIMING MAP (High Knock Detected)

Due to the nature of Airtrek High knocking engine, tuner always reduce the ignition timing at peak boost and high rpm to acceptable timing (see RON95 MAP) to compensate knock

Even if you put in RON100, the maximum timing run with this map will still be limited by RON95 MAP,the only way u would see benefit is to reflash RON97/RON100 Map to the Airtrek. (this only applicable to tuned airtrek as stock standard ATR ecu from JAPAN are normally set for 'HI-OKU' = RON100 ( but with when run with RON95 super duper knock, hahaha)

In summary No - ATR will not adapt to RON100 ignition timing, just significantly less knock and smoother power delivery.


In Contrary : MAZDA recent (Post2013) ECU algorithm have 3 BASE MAP

1)BASE TIMING MAP (No Knock Detected)
2)MAX TIMING MAP (No Further Knock Detected)
2)MIN TIMING MAP (High Knock Detected)

Mazda ecu will use BASE TIMING MAP and listen to knock, if no furthrer knock detected.
The ECU will add ignition timing more (until it hit MAX TIMING MAP) , so if u use RON100, and BASE TIMING is at 11 degree. If there is no further knock detected. The ignition Timing will be added incrementally(up to +5 = 16 degree <-examples only) automatically by ecu.
MIN TIMING MAP similar to mitsu's when it detected high knock and Timing will be reduced.



(BELOW IMAGE AS EXAMPLES ONLY-DON'T TAKE IT SERIOUSLY.)

Thanks for the detailed explanation. When you mentioned about 'recent Mazda', can you share which year it begins to have this feature?

 

[vr2turbo]

Is your daily routine to work 100% jam?
260-280km full tank is terrible mileage

In town drive my VR also around 280 to 300km per tank, mix highway/town maybe 320 to 340km only

 

[Ss_Tuner]

Mazda year 2010++ only. Adaptive ignition timing by RON.Means it will adapt to the fuel RON.3 maps group all together
(Low Knock(High Ron)+ Base+ High Knock(Low RON)

But for most Japan Car and Ecu were set to run Minimum RON.2 map groups all together
(Base + High Knock(Low RON))

Thanks for the detailed explanation. When you mentioned about 'recent Mazda', can you share which year it begins to have this feature?