Brake Hose

[Izso]

For the rubber brake hoses actually with time they harden not soften...hahhaha and tendency of breaking if twisted or over pressured....

Ya meh? My old ones would balloon up whenever I press the brakes, it was ridiculous.

 

[vr2turbo]

Ya meh? My old ones would balloon up whenever I press the brakes, it was ridiculous.

Yours got problem or due to local parts.....
Mine still original (24 years)....

 

[Izso]

Yours got problem or due to local parts.....
Mine still original (24 years)....

Yours not Proton. My rubber hoses were ori. I've only changed once and that was to the braided lines

 

[6UE5t]

Like what Ken and Vr2 said - get it from a reputable spare parts shop. Or go to one that you have a relationship with. I go to a spare parts shop that know me by name, they give me the best prices and tell me which are ori and which are fake. They don't sell fake at ori prices, usually always ask customers which ones they want. It's their customers like the workshops that are unscrupulous, buy fake sell ori prices.



Erm. Hate to be a stickler but brake hoses doesn't reduce brake fade, nor does 5.1 brake fluid. Brake hoses just firms pedal feel since the original hoses are made of rubber and over time rubber softens and wears out causing it to expand under pressure. Expanding rubber means more brake pedal pressure to deliver the brake oil to the calipers. Steel braided hoses prevent that expansion that results in a firm brake pedal feel all the time. Only thing is one needs to keep these hoses clean otherwise risk getting dirt lodged in between the braiding which will cause leaking over time. The Superstreet hoses are wrapped so the chances of it getting dirt is super slim, which is the only reason why I recommend this brand over others. I've used Improve braided hoses, BF Goodridge and both work well. Main thing is keeping it clean.

DOT5.1 fluid is backward compatible with DOT4 and DOT3 oils. DOT5 is silicon based and isn't compatible with the lot. The major difference between these oils is the boiling point of the oil. DOT5.1 has the highest boiling point. The benefit of having a higher boiling point is so the oil doesn't evaporate and introduce air pockets in the brake lines which result in spongy brake feel. How does it evaporate? Heavy braking introduces heat and heat eventually will boil the oil in the brake line. I used to use DOT3 in my Wira but even with steel braided hoses it would still be spongy after an aggressive downhill drive. Changing to DOT5.1 resolved that.

The only way to really reduce brake fade is to use higher temperature rated brake pads and ventilated + cross drilled + slotted rotors. Brake fade is caused by gases built up between the brake pad and the rotor when under extreme heat. The slots and holes in your rotor help dissipate those gases and some high temp pads don't "release" gases until you hit their max temperature.

End of rant.

Well maybe different understanding. To me when my pedal feels like is going deeper & deeper to the floor and more spongy after drving hard, I simply call it fading. Using upgraded hose and fluids do help with those, that's what I mean. This is especially very evident after I go down genting.

 

[vr2turbo]

Well maybe different understanding. To me when my pedal feels like is going deeper & deeper to the floor and more spongy after drving hard, I simply call it fading. Using upgraded hose and fluids do help with those, that's what I mean. This is especially very evident after I go down genting.

If your brakes are going down after hard drive means your brake fluid boiling and become spongy.

Brake fade is when there is no braking force felt even though you step hard on the brakes. This can be experience using normal brake pads, then coming down Genting and repeatedly using the brakes to slow down. Once the pads over heat and passed their working temperature there will be no brake grip and that is brake fade, or when on the track after a few hard braking corners you feel that there is no more braking force.....

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

If your brakes are going down after hard drive means your brake fluid boiling and become spongy.

Brake fade is when there is no braking force felt even though you step hard on the brakes. This can be experience using normal brake pads, then coming down Genting and repeatedly using the brakes to slow down. Once the pads over heat and passed their working temperature there will be no brake grip and that is brake fade, or when on the track after a few hard braking corners you feel that there is no more braking force.....

scary experience when u were racing (*in endurance mode) coming to a 90degree tight corner with full speed and your brake didnt gave the haul u normally have.....

only one option...stay straight in the grass trap :stupid:

 

[vr2turbo]

scary experience when u were racing (*in endurance mode) coming to a 90degree tight corner with full speed and your brake didnt gave the haul u normally have.....

only one option...stay straight in the grass trap :stupid:

No grass trap then how?......hahhahhahahha

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

No grass trap then how?......hahhahhahahha

straight to barrier or whatsoever waiting there

 

[mADmAN]

The only way to really reduce brake fade is to use higher temperature rated brake pads and ventilated + cross drilled + slotted rotors. Brake fade is caused by gases built up between the brake pad and the rotor when under extreme heat. The slots and holes in your rotor help dissipate those gases and some high temp pads don't "release" gases until you hit their max temperature.

End of rant.

imho.. the only way to reduce brake fade is higher temp brake pads and if possible help the cooling abit... ventilated discs... and perhaps airducts to the brakes...if ur extreme enough. slotted discs is fine...

i really dont recommend cross drilled... its an old technology... gasses? brake pads these days dont really produce gasses... those gasses things were way back when asbestos were being used in the pads....cooling? less surface area for heat to dissipate... remember... those holes were designed to expel gasses... not take in air... and more importantly... safety. even R35's factory cross drilled rotors can crack... imagine the cheap performance rotors we buy.

i would go with ventilated solid rotors... more surface area for heat to dissipate... and more surface area for the brake pad to bite into.

one aspect that most people tend to miss out in rotors is the cooling vanes in ventilated rotors.. the way the vanes are designed are mostly the same but some are different and can really help with cooling.

 

[ken yeang]

For good brake disk, the internal of ventilated brake disk oso affect the cooling capability of the brake.
Some disks have fins that draws air within the disk when it spins.....this cools the disk from inside as well....


So, if all measures taken, and still brakes not good enuf, the use water cooled brakes......which was popularly used in rally cars...

 

[vr2turbo]

For good brake disk, the internal of ventilated brake disk oso affect the cooling capability of the brake.
Some disks have fins that draws air within the disk when it spins.....this cools the disk from inside as well....


So, if all measures taken, and still brakes not good enuf, the use water cooled brakes......which was popularly used in rally cars...

You mean spray water? Not when too hot, it may warp the disc.....

 

[ken yeang]

You mean spray water? Not when too hot, it may warp the disc.....

On rally cars, the cooling is done on the caliper...not on the brake disk. So there will be no warping of the brake disk.

The temperature of brake system on rally cars are monitored digitally. This is to ensure the optimum operating temperature for the brake pad to bite on the brake disk -everytime.

 

[Waiora_ProTuner]

You mean spray water? Not when too hot, it may warp the disc.....

but StopTech said they never seen a warp disc...even in racing car..

the feeling of 'warp disc' is due to deposit on disc...

-Warped- Brake Disc and Other Myths

 

[vr2turbo]

but StopTech said they never seen a warp disc...even in racing car..

the feeling of 'warp disc' is due to deposit on disc...

-Warped- Brake Disc and Other Myths

hmmm... I thought hot metal when splash with water especially if some parts get it and some parts don't the contraction may warp the disc. If it is that tough then should go ahead with water cooling like some convert spray to intercoolers......

 

[^pomen_GTR^]

i think dba australia have a very good cooling fin for their disc brake.... top notch design

 

[KenDiriwan]

i think dba australia have a very good cooling fin for their disc brake.... top notch design

Also claimed to have longer rotor lifespan even with oem-replace series.

 

[Izso]

imho.. the only way to reduce brake fade is higher temp brake pads and if possible help the cooling abit... ventilated discs... and perhaps airducts to the brakes...if ur extreme enough. slotted discs is fine...

i really dont recommend cross drilled... its an old technology... gasses? brake pads these days dont really produce gasses... those gasses things were way back when asbestos were being used in the pads....cooling? less surface area for heat to dissipate... remember... those holes were designed to expel gasses... not take in air... and more importantly... safety. even R35's factory cross drilled rotors can crack... imagine the cheap performance rotors we buy.

i would go with ventilated solid rotors... more surface area for heat to dissipate... and more surface area for the brake pad to bite into.

one aspect that most people tend to miss out in rotors is the cooling vanes in ventilated rotors.. the way the vanes are designed are mostly the same but some are different and can really help with cooling.

Air ducts to the brakes is a good idea! Usually evident in sports cars but some cool the disc. Personally I think it should cool the caliper rather than the disc but that's just my POV.

Brake pads still do "produce" gases, when pads are heated beyond their operating temperature the bonding agents of the pads start to "evaporate" which produces a layer of "gas" between the pad and disc. It's just a matter of the quality of the bonding agent and the temperature resistance of the brake material. I doubt they still use asbestos in this day and age. But like you said - the best way to avoid brake fade is to get better pads. High temp pads however probably wouldn't be good daily pads. Last time I tried high temp I couldn't brake when it was cold. zero brakes when cold. That was insanely scary.

And you're right about the cross drill cracking. You've probably seen your fair share of cracked discs. I guess it depends on application. If you're driving a humble 1.5L Wira you'll never see cracks if the discs were cast molded from the factory with drilled holes? I only have a peeve with those DIYers who go and drill their own holes in their solid rotors. If it wasn't designed for that purpose why do people do it? Anyway, I didn't say the holes suck in air la. I said they help dissipate those gases mah.

i think dba australia have a very good cooling fin for their disc brake.... top notch design

They also have top notch prices

 

[vr2turbo]

I still having my set of 800 degree pads which like you say is not ideal for daily drive. Even after 15km reach office the bite is still not there, but if can really heat them up, stopping from high speed is d*mn good. Lightly tap the brakes and it slows down immediately, but every morning no brakes....

I was pretty lucky with my cross drilled disc then. After transplant of my engine and before transplant of the brakes which the disc was all rusty, had it skimmed and cross drilled. In it's 12 years of life no crack, skimmed one more time, and 3 sets of Bendix Metal King, from Metal King Plus, Metal King Gold and Metal King Titanium. After that change to Shoji solid disc and Trestor Blue Advantage....

 

[mADmAN]

Air ducts to the brakes is a good idea! Usually evident in sports cars but some cool the disc. Personally I think it should cool the caliper rather than the disc but that's just my POV.

Brake pads still do "produce" gases, when pads are heated beyond their operating temperature the bonding agents of the pads start to "evaporate" which produces a layer of "gas" between the pad and disc. It's just a matter of the quality of the bonding agent and the temperature resistance of the brake material. I doubt they still use asbestos in this day and age. But like you said - the best way to avoid brake fade is to get better pads. High temp pads however probably wouldn't be good daily pads. Last time I tried high temp I couldn't brake when it was cold. zero brakes when cold. That was insanely scary.

And you're right about the cross drill cracking. You've probably seen your fair share of cracked discs. I guess it depends on application. If you're driving a humble 1.5L Wira you'll never see cracks if the discs were cast molded from the factory with drilled holes? I only have a peeve with those DIYers who go and drill their own holes in their solid rotors. If it wasn't designed for that purpose why do people do it? Anyway, I didn't say the holes suck in air la. I said they help dissipate those gases mah.



They also have top notch prices

nola...i didnt say u said the holes take air in... its just a common thing people think about the holes..."the holes give airflow so helps cooling"

as for the brake ducts...theres 2 schools of thought... cool the discs and cool the caliper

but to cool the discs, alot recommended to put the hose to the center of the rotor.. the top hat.. so that the air will go through the cooling vanes in the disc.

as for calipers... i read on EBC site that they recommend cooling the calipers... to minimize "caliper drag" aka.. when the pads heat up and expand to the point that they slightly touch the rotors.

 

[vr2turbo]

nola...i didnt say u said the holes take air in... its just a common thing people think about the holes..."the holes give airflow so helps cooling"

as for the brake ducts...theres 2 schools of thought... cool the discs and cool the caliper

but to cool the discs, alot recommended to put the hose to the center of the rotor.. the top hat.. so that the air will go through the cooling vanes in the disc.

as for calipers... i read on EBC site that they recommend cooling the calipers... to minimize "caliper drag" aka.. when the pads heat up and expand to the point that they slightly touch the rotors.

Brake disc system, the pads are always touching the rotors, whether hot or not. If the pads heat up and expand the piston should got back in to allow the same space between pads and rotors...