supercharging Gen2

[geeteear34]

the gen2 engine character well known for it laggy when on lower rpm range eventho the bhp and torque output quite ok for th 1.6cc. worse if the gen2 is using auto gearbox.

can i install a supercharger to improve the low to mid range power band?
what brand suitable? how much the cost of supercharger kit alone and other necessary parts?

not to high boosting it.just more kick on lower rpm range.do i need an intercooler?must upgrade / mods the ecu? what engine internals must be changed?

please help

 

[vteckiller]

Originally posted by geeteear34@Feb 28 2005, 06:36
the gen2 engine character well known for it laggy when on lower rpm range eventho the bhp and torque output quite ok for th 1.6cc. worse if the gen2 is using auto gearbox.

can i install a supercharger to improve the low to mid range power band?
what brand suitable? how much the cost of supercharger kit alone and other necessary parts?

not to high boosting it.just more kick on lower rpm range.do i need an intercooler?must upgrade / mods the ecu? what engine internals must be changed?

please help

would be much easier to install a turbo kit..
custom made manifold,
a tdo4 turbo charger, small intercooler, a piggy bag ecu.
should be ok. 0.4bar of boost should be okay.
definately make nicer power a small turbo charger would be better for low rpm range.

 

[razaksa]

Originally posted by geeteear34@Feb 28 2005, 06:36
the gen2 engine character well known for it laggy when on lower rpm range eventho the bhp and torque output quite ok for th 1.6cc. worse if the gen2 is using auto gearbox.

can i install a supercharger to improve the low to mid range power band?
what brand suitable? how much the cost of supercharger kit alone and other necessary parts?

not to high boosting it.just more kick on lower rpm range.do i need an intercooler?must upgrade / mods the ecu? what engine internals must be changed?

please help

Hi Geeteear34

If you are really interested in supercharging your Gen2 check out the thread below,

http://zerotohundred.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=38418

Gerard from Draeger Racing has successfully supercharged Satria Gti and is currently looking for a Gen2 test car for supercharging in the KL/Kepong area. If you are really interested give him a call, his contact details are in the above thread. Think he's got the most suitable mod to improve low to mid rpm hp and torque. Cheers.

Sazali

 

[hyper_tuner]

i think that supercharging the Gen2 is a good idea....

 

[gerard]

Originally posted by hyper_tuner@Mar 1 2005, 20:57
i think that supercharging the Gen2 is a good idea....

Base on your quote above, may I ask why do you agreed to a Gen2 supercharged and mind sharing what information you have on Gen2. I am trying to put a battle plan together to test out Gen2 with a sc kit...

Any info pertaining to this new Gen2 engine is greatly appreciated. :rolleyes:

Thanks in advance & regards
Gerard :D

 

[razaksa]

Originally posted by gerard+Mar 2 2005, 00:20 --></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (gerard @ Mar 2 2005, 00:20 )</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-hyper_tuner@Mar 1 2005, 20:57
i think that supercharging the Gen2 is a good idea....

Base on your quote above, may I ask why do you agreed to a Gen2 supercharged and mind sharing what information you have on Gen2. I am trying to put a battle plan together to test out Gen2 with a sc kit...

Any info pertaining to this new Gen2 engine is greatly appreciated. :rolleyes:

Thanks in advance & regards
Gerard :D [/b][/quote]
Gerard

Here's some info on the Gen2 engine;

http://www.proton.com/innovation/rnd/campro.php

 

[gerard]

razaksa,
Thanks for the link...What's your personal feedback since using this engine and car?. What are the problems you faced so far (if there's any).

Your daily driving habits or style and how does the engine response to your driving style?..

How's the power, throttle response & torque for hill climbs or with full passenger load?

Fuel consumption?. ...

Any feedback from you and other Gen2 owners is greatly appreciated.

Thanks again :D

Regards
gerard :rolleyes:

 

[razaksa]

Originally posted by gerard@Mar 2 2005, 10:21
razaksa,
Thanks for the link...What's your personal feedback since using this engine and car?. What are the problems you faced so far (if there's any).

Your daily driving habits or style and how does the engine response to your driving style?..

How's the power, throttle response & torque for hill climbs or with full passenger load?

Fuel consumption?. ...

Any feedback from you and other Gen2 owners is greatly appreciated.

Thanks again :D

Regards
gerard :rolleyes:

Gerard

I've had the G2 for abt 5 mths my mileage is 13000km. Power and torque is quite dissapointing below 3000rpm, but the high end is quite good, Ive touched 200km/h before on the NS highway. Don't have any problems so far with the engine(so does all the G2ers that I know) and have been sending it to Proton for regular servicing using fully synthetic oil. The handling and ride stability is excellent.
My driving style? I'm always in a hurry most of the time :D so my right foot is quite light esp on take offs.
I'm currently using 421 extractors with OEM exhaust and K&N drop in filter, however the torque and power improvements is minimal.
Btw is it advisable to use high cams with a SC. What u think of using a water cooling mist spray with ur SC system to cool the compressed air?
Overall I think there's a lot of improvement to be made in power to weight ratio through SCing. However take note that the compression ratio is 10:1 and the ECU is Siemens VDO also it's using a drive by wire system. Thanks.

Sazali

 

[gerard]

sazali,

Thanks for the valuable information and also the thread or link you provided me

My best guess on the issue on low end response is weak is due to its cam profile..
Great to know that that Gen2 is not having much problems as I've heard lots of grapevines that this car is very problematic...That's why it's better to hear it from the owners itself...That is indeed a big plus point for you and for us...

Top end power seems good....Does it take long to get there (200km) or are there any flat spots along the way to 200km....Just wanna understand more on the profile of the Gen2 OEM cams..Is it with the ac on and with how many persons on board.?

We will definately try out the sc on a gen2 when things are less hectic....The biggest challenge here for us involving newer generations from the proton fleet is the lack of knowledge with the ecu siemens...I have done many, many wiring transplant for GTI, from siemens to mmc and most customers complaints are the instability of the ecu or in relation with idling...and power loss at high rpms...

On the issue of high cams and water injection with the sc kit, I will reveal more when the GTI sc stage 2 is ready...It's in it's final phase of testing and mapping...and once it's ready I will inform you guys more accurately on the benefits or is there any at all involving the sc with cams and WI.....Hope there is improvement as many stage 1 owners are pastering me for further mods on the sc and it's kit...

Keep in touch and thanks again

Regards & cheers
gerard :rolleyes:

 

[razaksa]

Gerard

I cant specifically recall how long it takes to get to 200km/h but definitely not as fast as a 2.0L would and doesnt seem to be any flatspots the rpm meter increases at a constant rate. it was me ,wifey and 2yr old son in the car with a/c on.
Someone told me that the cams used are quarter race(can't verify) Funny they call it Campro engine but the cam profiling technology is not present.
What u think of ussing piggyback. I've seen SMT6 quite reasonable pricing can control ignition timing and A/F Ratio.
I see the GTI SC pulley is on the right side, but the G2 pulley assembly is on the left side, will this cause a problem? Thanks.

Sazali

 

[gerard]

Originally posted by razaksa@Mar 3 2005, 01:39
Gerard

I cant specifically recall how long it takes to get to 200km/h but definitely not as fast as a 2.0L would and doesnt seem to be any flatspots the rpm meter increases at a constant rate. it was me ,wifey and 2yr old son in the car with a/c on.
Someone told me that the cams used are quarter race(can't verify) Funny they call it Campro engine but the cam profiling technology is not present.
What u think of ussing piggyback. I've seen SMT6 quite reasonable pricing can control ignition timing and A/F Ratio.
I see the GTI SC pulley is on the right side, but the G2 pulley assembly is on the left side, will this cause a problem? Thanks.

Sazali

razaksa,

This engine layout is a challenge due to space...two options is available but each method still requires a resonable amount of space for mounting..Perhaps a long nose sc unit for these engine layouts but these units are hard to come by and new ones cost a bomb to purchase..Let just see how it goes

Then that an impressive 200km run..Good ro know that flat spots doesn't exist. :lol:

On the piggy back, It will try it out and see how it function and it's flexibility with tuning and controls....

I was approach by two korean make cars recently and their request is the same ..can my ride be supercharged ...one's a Hyundai and the other is a Kia but both pose the newer tech engine layout, crank pulley on the left side...I will try out few methods and will keep you posted....when things are less hectic ya..

Drawing out a battle plan now and will execute them when time permits...

Hope it all falls into place nicely... :rolleyes:

regards & thannks for the help in the link to asian auto :D
gerard

 

[razaksa]

Gerard

Long nose sc units are those like the ones from Nissan March K10? With your current hectic workload when do you reckon the SC unit for G2 can be ready? :D I'm still yet to find any SC specialist here in Singapore and Jb area, if any :rolleyes: . Thanks

Sazali

 

[gerard]

Originally posted by razaksa@Mar 3 2005, 02:40
Gerard

Long nose sc units are those like the ones from Nissan March K10? With your current hectic workload when do you reckon the SC unit for G2 can be ready? :D I'm still yet to find any SC specialist here in Singapore and Jb area, if any :rolleyes: . Thanks

Sazali

razaksa,

When I can be ready?. Now, thats a very difficult question to answer....At the moment we are very busy with the mmc proton models, then comes the siemens type for testing....Once that is done, then Gen2 is probably next...I hope so too...

I guess, many ppl are familiar with turbo as they are more popular compared to its cousin, superchargers...I wouldn't dare think or say I'm a sc specialist as I'm still learning and toying with it and it (sc) does pose new problems now & then for us to solve.....Hahaha :D

The k-10 is too small for a 1.6 litre engine...You will need at least a sc unit with 1400 -1600cc where power gains will be gradual and not too sudden which will cause problems for the auto gearbox over a period of time...

Too small in size will see the sc run out of breath too soon.

Regards
gerard :rolleyes:

 

[TitanRev]

Originally posted by geeteear34@Feb 28 2005, 06:36
the gen2 engine character well known for it laggy when on lower rpm range eventho the bhp and torque output quite ok for th 1.6cc. worse if the gen2 is using auto gearbox.

can i install a supercharger to improve the low to mid range power band?
what brand suitable? how much the cost of supercharger kit alone and other necessary parts?

not to high boosting it.just more kick on lower rpm range.do i need an intercooler?must upgrade / mods the ecu? what engine internals must be changed?

please help

Does supercharging will be more evidence on automatic cars ? cause auto cars pick up is quite sluggish. I wish to install a SC kit for my Peugoet 206. How much would it cost for the whole process ? Will there be any waranty from the installer ? :unsure:

 

[gerard]

Originally posted by TitanRev+Mar 3 2005, 20:33 --></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (TitanRev @ Mar 3 2005, 20:33 )</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-geeteear34@Feb 28 2005, 06:36
the gen2 engine character well known for it laggy when on lower rpm range eventho the bhp and torque output quite ok for th 1.6cc. worse if the gen2 is using auto gearbox.

can i install a supercharger to improve the low to mid range power band?
what brand suitable? how much the cost of supercharger kit alone and other necessary parts?

not to high boosting it.just more kick on lower rpm range.do i need an intercooler?must upgrade / mods the ecu? what engine internals must be changed?

please help

Does supercharging will be more evidence on automatic cars ? cause auto cars pick up is quite sluggish. I wish to install a SC kit for my Peugoet 206. How much would it cost for the whole process ? Will there be any waranty from the installer ? :unsure: [/b][/quote]
titanrev,

Glad to know you are follower of supercharging, so far we have not done and work on supercharging a continental car...I cant really say wether it will work or how much is involved for this process...There are many factors to take into consideration..

One for sure is space availability to mount the sc unit
two, can I use a piggyback fuel computer or a stand alone unit

Once the above 2 factor is resolved, then the other challenge would be mapping and setting then right..On the issue of auto tranny, it would help in torque but have to be gentle with your right foot, else tranny would suffer.

Regards
gerard :D

ps: the 206 is one cute, lovely car, thumbs up :D

 

[razaksa]

Gerard

All the best with your R N D works and do keep me updated with the latest developments on SC for Gen2. Would be great if it could be ready by end of 05, by then my mileage should be about 30000km and would have a better idea on reliability and integrity of the Gen2 engine. Btw had a closer look at the intake air manifold at the rear of the engine, there should be enough space to mount the 4agze sc unit after removing the stock air filter box. I guess a fair bit of customization has to be done for mounting, manifold, pulley system etc. Thanks.

Sazali

 

[gerard]

sazali,

Thanks for the tips and info, You can bet on it that we will try out SCing to the Gen2 and hopefully by end of this year or early next year..Will definately keep you inform and posted.

Many thanks again for all help.

Regards
gerard :D