Launch: 2017 PORSCHE 911 MK2 - NA NO MORE

drummydrew

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The Europeans have already turbocharged almost all of their lineup. Now the Japanese are starting to do it with Honda trying it on Civic. Soon other manufacturers will follow suit for sure.

Sure there are several ways to differentiate between a standard Carrera and Turbo other than the engine itself. Some traits of 911 Turbo are wider body at rear and that side air vent near the rear wheel arch.

What I mean about 911 Turbo is left in a confused state is, the originality and special trait of 911 Turbo is getting less clear now. It used to be unique as it is the only turbocharged 911 among its variants. Later on 4WD came to the 911 Turbo during 993 generation which became another special trait of 911 Turbo. Now, I'm quite sure that the Carrera 4 and 4S that will come later is going to be turbocharged 4WD as well.

Yes, I know that Porsche will still make the 911 Turbo a more powerful car than the Carrera series but the thing is, 911 Turbo is no longer as unique as it used to be now. Sorry for the long post, maybe I'm just thinking in a purist kind of way.
exactly! even honda which has always been famed for its domination within the NA scene has now moved on. soon enough, the quote "no replacement for displacement" will be dismissed to make way for turbo era :hmmmm:

your statement is now clear to me :idea: no worries bout the elaborated post, i'm more than glad to be reading and getting more insight. it is always saddening for purists to see their favorite cars evolve into something blurry or even lose their originality. feeeels
 

RENESIS VIII

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exactly! even honda which has always been famed for its domination within the NA scene has now moved on. soon enough, the quote "no replacement for displacement" will be dismissed to make way for turbo era :hmmmm:

your statement is now clear to me :idea: no worries bout the elaborated post, i'm more than glad to be reading and getting more insight. it is always saddening for purists to see their favorite cars evolve into something blurry or even lose their originality. feeeels
Imagine few decades later when turbocharged cars are everywhere and you let some drivers who have never driven NA before to try out some NA engine. Specifically NA engines with independent throttle body like 4A-GE 20 valve. They are probably going to be shocked with the instantaneous response and loud intake roar from NA engines. Just like how some of us are fascinated by blow off sound and the sudden kick in feeling from turbo engines. :biggrin:

Well, purists can't really do anything to change the decision from manufacturers. Other than Porsche, other cars are also following the same fate. Like BMW M cars where previously they are all Straight 6 NA. Later on they went V8 and V10. Now going into turbo. Ferrari and Lamborghini no longer makes cars with traditional manual gearbox. Mazda have stopped manufacturing rotary engines for now. The famous 8.4 litre Dodge Viper is also officially announced to be dead few days ago. I guess individuality and uniqueness in automotive is hard to be retained now due to emission laws.
 

vr2turbo

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exactly! even honda which has always been famed for its domination within the NA scene has now moved on. soon enough, the quote "no replacement for displacement" will be dismissed to make way for turbo era :hmmmm:
But Forced Induction (Turbo/Super charged) is considered displacement also. Forcing a small displacement to become a bigger one......:rofl::driver:
 

RENESIS VIII

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while it might seem like a huge move away from NA, I for one won't miss the NA. On the most part because I have yet to have one long enough to live with so no nostalgia there. Secondly, unless we are talking about GT Porsches or any notable performance car that are NA based for that matter, there's really nothing much to be missed IMHO.

Regular 911s will substantially benefit from the move to turbo, just like how the current BMWs and Mercs are force fed.

On regular daily cars, I think these new turbo engines are just so much more enjoyable to drive compared to the NAs of before.
If it is about better torque at low end RPM, the turbo engines will have the advantage over NA.

But I think what people might miss in NA are the quick response, engine acoustics and the smooth high revving nature. I guess this is more of a feeling kind of thing rather than practicability.

All in all, the move to turbo is for the sake of efficiency and practicability while NA is more of having fun in a different way. It is almost like the case of dual clutch transmission vs manual transmission.
 

drummydrew

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that's legit explanation coming from sifus who have test driven so many cars of different characteristics. i surely need more exposure and understanding before making hasty statements :trytofly:
 

RENESIS VIII

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that's legit explanation coming from sifus who have test driven so many cars of different characteristics. i surely need more exposure and understanding before making hasty statements :trytofly:
I'm not any sifu myself. I'm just 23 this year and I have very limited first hand test drive experience compared to many other members here. Probably you have more experience than I do when it comes to test drive. I still have more to learn from reading over here.
 

Tom

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If it is about better torque at low end RPM, the turbo engines will have the advantage over NA.

But I think what people might miss in NA are the quick response, engine acoustics and the smooth high revving nature. I guess this is more of a feeling kind of thing rather than practicability.

All in all, the move to turbo is for the sake of efficiency and practicability while NA is more of having fun in a different way. It is almost like the case of dual clutch transmission vs manual transmission.
Fair point renesis, but today's Turbo engines pretty much cover the needs of drivers today, be it response, efficiency, power, even maybe sound. Do I like the new BMW'S more than the NA ones of before? Very much yes. I can visualize the sensation of their 6 cylinder NA engines and I love them but to be honest I hardly miss it. If I see or drive one today, I still get excited yes.

Its BMW M's 8000+ RPM engines and those are special. Pedigrees such as this should be preserved yes

Its the everyday cars that people should embrace new tech, such as this 991.2 911 for example.










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Izso

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Complaining about a Porsche going from NA to Turbo is like a spoilt brat complaining his RM30,000 Vertu phone only supports Itunes and no longer supports MP3s.

Meaning only those who actually own the the NA will care about the turbo. The rest of us can only dream of the day we own a Porsche for real.
 

RENESIS VIII

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Fair point renesis, but today's Turbo engines pretty much cover the needs of drivers today, be it response, efficiency, power, even maybe sound. Do I like the new BMW'S more than the NA ones of before? Very much yes. I can visualize the sensation of their 6 cylinder NA engines and I love them but to be honest I hardly miss it. If I see or drive one today, I still get excited yes.

Its BMW M's 8000+ RPM engines and those are special. Pedigrees such as this should be preserved yes

Its the everyday cars that people should embrace new tech, such as this 991.2 911 for example.


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Makes sense about going turbocharged in daily cars since most users are more into practicability than fun. But can this 911 Carrera considered to be a daily car more than a performance car? Yes, I know that many have said about Porsche Carrera series being one of those sports car that is practical enough for daily drive.

When it comes to BMW M engines, I like the the previous S65 V8 engine that comes with ITB. It sounds better than the new S55 turbo in the new M3 and M4. Too bad that BMW is moving away from NA.
 

RENESIS VIII

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Complaining about a Porsche going from NA to Turbo is like a spoilt brat complaining his RM30,000 Vertu phone only supports Itunes and no longer supports MP3s.

Meaning only those who actually own the the NA will care about the turbo. The rest of us can only dream of the day we own a Porsche for real.
What I'm saying is, the move to turbo had somewhat blurred the distinction line between a normal 911 with a 911 Turbo. I'm not sure on how to put it but this makes it feel like soon the 911 lineup is going to be a line of very similar cars with minor differences unlike before. Now, turbo is no longer a standalone trait that belongs to 911 Turbo, Turbo S and GT2. Perhaps Porsche might do some changes to the 911 Turbo to give it a clearer identity compared to other 911.

I'm not saying the new Carrera turbo is a bad car or a wrong move by Porsche. Just that I felt it had somehow dampened the appeal of 911 Turbo.
 

Tom

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What I'm saying is, the move to turbo had somewhat blurred the distinction line between a normal 911 with a 911 Turbo. I'm not sure on how to put it but this makes it feel like soon the 911 lineup is going to be a line of very similar cars with minor differences unlike before. Now, turbo is no longer a standalone trait that belongs to 911 Turbo, Turbo S and GT2. Perhaps Porsche might do some changes to the 911 Turbo to give it a clearer identity compared to other 911.

I'm not saying the new Carrera turbo is a bad car or a wrong move by Porsche. Just that I felt it had somehow dampened the appeal of 911 Turbo.
The 911 Turbo is distinct just as always and doesn't make it any less distinct even if its lesser siblings adopt forced induction. Today's people are definitely smarter than before and know the difference between a 800K 911 Carrera and what might be a 2018 1.2M(?) 911 Turbo even if both of them are turbocharged.

The 911 Turbo will also be the widest 911 as always, likely pack double the power of regular 911s , gets the best of what Porsche has to offer and more.

So i don't see how this dampens the appeal of the high end Turbo model and like you said, they'd likely make their top tier cars different than their regular line up
 

RENESIS VIII

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The 911 Turbo is distinct just as always and doesn't make it any less distinct even if its lesser siblings adopt forced induction. Today's people are definitely smarter than before and know the difference between a 800K 911 Carrera and what might be a 2018 1.2M(?) 911 Turbo even if both of them are turbocharged.

The 911 Turbo will also be the widest 911 as always, likely pack double the power of regular 911s , gets the best of what Porsche has to offer and more.

So i don't see how this dampens the appeal of the high end Turbo model and like you said, they'd likely make their top tier cars different than their regular line up
Certainly there will be an amount of difference between the base Carrera and the top end 911 Turbo. Is just that turbocharging is no longer an exclusiveness reserved for 911 Turbo and GT2. Putting this aside, the good thing from this new engine is that tuning the Carrera for more power will be easier due to turbocharging.

Now that Carrera had gone through this radical change, perhaps we can expect Porsche to come up with something unexpected for the current 991 911 Turbo facelift to set the bar even higher.
 

vr2turbo

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Porsche or Sports car aside, if talking about Turbo and NA, I think Bro. Renesis probably confused from old school turbo like mine and new Generation of turbo. Old school are mainly power turbo with turbo lag and power coming in after 3k RPM. Nowadays turbo can be tuned for torque like Proton Exora. They have turbo but are not powerful but they add torque for better drive. Then others like twin scroll, Variable and so on so is a whole new thing, even for oldie like me.....hhahhahahhah:biggrin:
 

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